Only one Dafydd supports independence

It's always good to have a speaker from the SNP at our party conference, for they share the same aims for their country as we do for ours, and the lessons we learn from them will only help us when it is our turn to hold a referendum.

This year the SNP guest speaker was Pete Wishart. On the subject of those who support independence at Westminster, this small snippet from his speech made me smile ... though perhaps not quite as much as it made Dafydd Wigley smile.

     

There's something like 1,500 parliamentarians in all of the Houses of Parliament at Westminster. 1,490 of those 1,500 parliamentarians are opposed to independence. There's ten that support independence: there's the six of us in the SNP, there's our three colleagues in Plaid Cymru ... and we've got Dafydd Wigley in the House of Lords.

Conference, I think that's quite good odds. They may have the quanity, but with our ten we most definitely have the quality ...

Pete Wishart is as aware as all the rest of us that there are in fact two Dafydds in the House of Lords who are members of Plaid Cymru. But even though Dafydd El Cid has managed to pull the wool over the eyes of some in Plaid Cymru's leadership about his support for independence (see here) he hasn't fooled anyone in the SNP.

This is Pete's speech in full.

     

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11 comments:

Meirionnydd said...

Elis-Thomas should be forced to choose whether he wants to be a Lord or whether he wants to be an AM. He cannot do two jobs at the same time as each other. It's obscene that he gets two sets of allowances.

Two faced. Two snouts. Two troughs.

MH said...

I don't have any time for the "snouts in the trough" narrative, M. But I do agree that he shouldn't be allowed to double-job in this way. I don't think it's possible to be an AM and do another job at the same time. The law allows it, but the law can be an ass. Therefore Plaid Cymru as a party needs to do something about it.

But the much bigger problem is that the party won't do anything about Dafydd's contempt for independence. As I've said before, a party like the SNP wouldn't tolerate a member who openly disagrees with the party's aims. Yet Plaid not only allows him to remain a member, but repeatedly lets him stand for election in the party's name. It makes us a laughing stock.

Neilyn said...

If Scotland vote Yes, as one would hope/expect, will DET change his position then I wonder? He'll certainly need a change of nappy.

I thoroughly enjoyed Pete Wishart's speech on Saturday. Oh to be a Scot in 2014!

Anonymous said...

Can't remember where but DET has said he supports Salmond and a yes vote in 2014.

Anonymous said...

Could it possibly be that Dafydd Wigley was actually installed as a Plaid Cymru Peer, but Dafydd El is officially a crossbencher?

Anonymous said...

Er ....... no, it couldn't.

Pete Wishart was talking about those who supported independence, not about which parties they belonged to.

MH said...

To both Neilyn and 20:30, the problem isn't so much what Dafydd says at any one time, but that he says different things to different people at different times.

Anonymous said...

So should Phil Williams have been thrown out of Plaid when he was the one supporting independence while the party was officially opposed ? Did he make a 'laughing stock' of us too?

Anonymous said...

Wigley said in 1999 that Plaid had "never ever advocated independence".
Somewhat strangely because Plaid obviously had advocated some forms of independence over the years. But Wigley had his own agenda and led Plaid to its greatest ever electoral success. Wigley was looking at a period when Wales had only just voted in favour of a measure of self-government.

MH said...

I would have to see the party's constitution as it existed at the time before being able to give an opinion on either Phil Williams or Dafydd Wigley.

The point is that under the constitution as it exists now, a person cannot be a member of Plaid Cymru unless they support the aims of the party, and independence in Europe is the first of those aims.

We need to be clear about the difference between the party's aims and the party's policies. There is plenty of room for debate and disagreement about the party's policies should be, but no room for those who do not agree with the party's aims.

Meirionnydd said...

Anon's comment of 22:19 (15 Oct) is wrong. There are officially two Plaid peers in the House of Lords, so Elis-Thomas does not sit as a crossbencher.

http://www.parliament.uk/mps-lords-and-offices/lords/composition-of-the-lords/

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